Resistance Training: The muscle miracle: can I build enough in my 60s to make it to 100 – even though I’ve never weight-trained?

#41

I can find no studies that suggest that leucine extends lifespan. The studies that suggest that leucine extends lifespan is the isoleucine form and that is only in animal studies and some suggest that it shortens lifespan.

I hope the studies that suggest high protein diets shorten lifespan are wrong, because I am currently on a higher protein diet because I am old and have been led to believe that I need more protein because of my body’s reduced capabilities to process it.

“In stark contrast to these short-term results, long-term retrospective and prospective cohort several studies have found that high protein consumption is associated with increased insulin resistance, diabetes, cancer, and overall mortality”

#42

Please read thoroughly. Metabolic dysfunction endpoints which most drugs that extend lifespan effect these pathways… And you’re using a bunch of biological studies to make an assumption. on 1.2g of leucine bid, not enough to activate mTOR. You’re using apples to oranges to confirm your bias. This has nothing to do with protein diets.

Metformin + leucine + sildenafil- now show me the data on this polypill which has nothing to do with anything you posted.

#43

The conventional wisdom for building muscle after 50yo was 3-5g of leucine per meal (protein dose 30-35gm) x 3-4 meals per day. But don’t supplement leucine….just eat enough protein.

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#44

Hi Admin
I find this topic of exercise and autophagy to be a very difficult one.
For example, resistance exercise has been shown to upregulate mTOR and boost muscle growth (and then presumably attenuate or deactivate autophagy).
Watson K., Baar K. mTOR and the health benefits of exercise. Seminars in Cell & Developmental Biology. 2014;36:130–139.

Making rats run on treadmills has been shown to activate mTOR and increase the rebuilding of brain cells. This has been a mechanism given for why exercise reduces depression.

Up-regulating mTOR causes cell growth and division whereas down-regulating mTOR generally stops cell growth and causes autophagy.

However this study that you have presented shows quite clearly that resistance training (that would normally uoregukate mTOR, cause cell growth but slow autophagy) can actually increase autophagy. This is the opposite of what one would expect with exercise.
From what I see in the summary they don’t include any downstream markers of mTOR deactivation, so perhaps there is another mechanism apart from mTOR that resistance training activates to influence the autophagy?

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#45

Exactly. I lost a great deal of upper arm and thigh muscle mass while basically immobilized for a month waiting for hip replacement. Very slow to regain.
Is irisin commercially available? If so, where.
What might be best supplement to help??
Gracias!

#46

Irisin is available as a lab chemical (and in studies its been injected). See this thread: Irisin Ameliorates Age-associated Sarcopenia and Metabolic Dysfunction

There is more data behind metformin / galantamine. If I was working to regain significant lost muscle I’d look at this new oral drug combo: Rejuvenate Biomed’s drug combination (metformin & galantamine) shows promise in sarcopenia in Phase 1b trial

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#47

A year ago I could not stand long enough to wash a set of dishes. I had palpable fatty infiltration of my quads and very visibly large loss of muscle mass. Ten years earlier I was very proud of my quads and have a photo from then, I’ll have to see if I can find that, then compare it to last June’s mass and again in a year. In July I had surgery that fixed both a major hip and a lower back issue. A sort of “second chance,” I’d say. With the issues fixed I finished losing a total of 54lbs ( with a bounce-back of about 7, which seems normal).

Able to hit the gym again I’ve regained quite a lot. My quads and biceps are no longer “squishy.” Yes, I have been lifting to failure, attempting to fail around 8-10 reps. So folk say that is not necessary, though I wish there’d be a bit more high quality pointing to data. I’m 73 and after losing the 50 lbs I looked just awful. (Though getting better w/ gains) If anyone can point to optimal “old guy” methodology of increasing both mass and strength, I’d love to see it.

All I know is that I am thrilled as can be to have gotten back to where I am today as compared to where I was last July. I do use exceptional care in form and never lift w/ inertia. That last lift to failure sure turns my face red, but otherwise I have not experienced anything negative. But, I’d prefer to use what would be optimal.

But to answer your question, sure, unless you have something that contraindicates lifting such as bad joints, but even there, one can usually work-around things. I have severe bilateral 1st thumb joint arthritis, so there are lifts and machines I simply can never do because I can’t hold a handle properly, those, I pass by and find another method to work that muscle group.

As for the amount of protein and timing, quality of protein and what not, I like this:

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#48

You might want to try wrist bar wraps. You slip them on your wrists ,they form a loop, and the tails you wrap around the bars. You then do not need any thumb strength to lock onto the grip. Your thumbs really a4e not for griping but to secure grip.

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#49

Good paper by an expert in the field. People should take note of those protein amounts.

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#50

“The intake of food containing proteins and leucine during meals stimulates muscle protein synthesis. Lower blood levels of leucine were associated with lower values of the skeletal muscle index, grip strength and performance. The international guidelines recommended that a leucine intake of 3 g at three main meals together with 25-30 g of protein is the goal to be achieved to counteract loss of lean mass in elderly.”

Search and for elderly you’ll find that to “trigger” anabolic processes a senior needs 3-4 grams per meal.
If you’re age 25 or 35 and you eat a turkey sandwich w/ 20 grams, you’ll prompt an anabolic response. If you’re 70, you will not. From what I’ve read leucine acts as a sort of “trigger,” and depending on what study you choose, it’s 3-4 grams of Leucine.

A high proportion of leucine is required for optimal stimulation of the rate of muscle protein synthesis by essential amino acids in the elderly. See:

https://journals.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/ajpendo.00488.2005

From this:

“The results suggest that the EAA leucine has a unique role in the stimulation of muscle protein synthesis by EAAs in elderly humans. Specifically, in the elderly, the leucine-enriched EAA mixture stimulated postprandial muscle protein synthesis and resulted in postprandial accretion of muscle proteins, reversing the lack of response following the whey protein-based EAA mixture. In contrast, in the young, both EAA mixtures stimulated muscle protein synthesis, and no unique advantage of extra leucine was evident.”

Again, that “trigger” seems to be (for an elder) 3-4 grams.

Desertshores, you say: “I eat 6 - 12 ounces every day so I assume I am getting enough leucine.”
My response is that it is likely that you are not.

Interestingly if you ate 12 ounces at one sitting, you will trigger the anabolic response. But if you eat 3 meals w/ 4 ounces from your list, you will not because you never got the minimum 3 or 4 grams per meal of leucine.

There’s a very easy fix, which is what I do. I’m a creature of habit and so I’ve done the calculations of how much leucine is in my tuna sandwich and then pop two or three OOO capsules of leucine. 0.6 grams fill one OOO capsule, if I take 3 with my sandwich I get 1.8 grams leucine + what is in the rest of the meal.

1 kilo of L-leucine on zon (Bulk Supplements) cost $28. That’s about 3 cents per gram including the capsule, so for lunch I spend six cents on leucine, but I’m sure that, if nothing else, there is enough to trigger the anabolic state.

I have an All-In-Capsule device that cost about $40 and it takes me about half an hour to fill 200 capsules.

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#51

Dr. Andy Galpin Unveils the 9 Core Principles of Training: Ultimate Human Performance Blueprint
Using the concept of progressive overload, this could be progressively increasing weight, changing the number of reps, or changing complexity of movement.

Yet, it seems to me that one cannot progressively increase weight unless you max out on the last repetition. Otherwise, your body will simply say: “Ok, I’m required to lift 50lbs this way, which I now can do, so why should I bother modifying my muscle to be able to lift more.” Let’s say that I can lift to last repetition of 60lbs. Then, if I do sets to 50lbs, over and over will my ability to lift 70lbs materialize? Probably not, unless I push past that 50lbs.

“Learn to move correctly and give your body time to develop tissue tolerance.”

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#52

I agree. And more recent papers suggest “maximum” is probably even higher.

The harder question is how to balance building and maintaining healthy proteins (muscles, etc) while allowing autophagy to occur often enough.

How to cycle the building vs breakdown of old proteins? High protein all the time doesn’t seem right nor does continuous calorie or protein restriction.

Is the period a few hours (have 12 hour gaps in meals), or 24 hours or 3 days? Or is it better to have hard shutdowns (fasting, rapamycin) every week or so, and otherwise be building?

Right now I’m betting on a combination of light and heavy cycles.

I fast and use Rapa once every 2 weeks with no weight training for 1 extra day. Otherwise I am using a 48 hour cycle using high muscle building stimulus followed by high protein consumption for 24 hours, followed by low protein/ lower calorie plus endurance training for the next 24 hours.

I’m trying to keep my weight steady (no extra body fat), build strength and (a little) muscle, and engage autophagy for long-term function and longevity.

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#53

I find myself eating, not because I’m hungry, but because I know I haven’t eaten enough protein.

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#54

It’s a recipe for an addiction. I suffer from it.